Darkest Hour – John Henry and Mike Schleibaum
Posted on August 17, 2009 at 12:00 am by Rob
Darkest Hour has been known to put on an intense, energy filled live show. It was no different when they stopped into Toronto as part of the Summer Slaughter Tour. I sat down with John Henry (vocals) and Mike Schleibaum (guitar) to talk about their new album “The Eternal Return”, the addition of Lonestar (guitar) to the band, Ryan Parrish’s (drums) hat, among other topics.
WayTooLoud!: How has metal from Sweden and speed metal had an effect on Darkest Hour?
John Henry: Metal from Sweden? That’s easy because we basically started sounding the way we do when Mike and I discovered all that stuff in high school. Bands like At The Gates and Entombed.
Mike Schleibaum: The Swedish metal came into play in high school for sure. With the speed metal I guess you mean stuff like Anthrax and Exodus. When I was younger I got into metal before I got into punk. This is kind of the opposite way that most people do it. I liked bands like Pantera and Slayer of course you’re like “Fuck! I gotta find tapes of other stuff!” Then you find Exodus and that’s pretty cool. Then you find Testament and you think that’s pretty cool. Then you find Anthrax and you like a couple of those records, and I think that all they did was effect the idea of it’s cool to be metal and be fast. It didn’t have the same impact as when we heard Swedish metal. All those bands it doesn’t sound nearly as pissed off. The way the Swedish bands interpreted it made it a little more technical, the production was a little newer. It was just crazier and I think that translation really grabbed me and John together. Where as the speed metal were really more like I were more like “yeah I was into that when I was a kid.” I still jam Anthrax and Testament all the time but I don’t like them as much as other metal, although the new Testament is pretty fucking good! It’s modern Testament.
WTL!: It hasn’t changed a whole lot but it sounds modern, probably because modern metal sounds like Testament
Mike: I think also that modern metal relies so much on production. Especially bands that are using blast beats and all sorts of super guitar harmonies. It all relies so much on production now that it is totally different.
WTL!: What did it mean to you to be able to join At The Gates on their reunion tour?
John: You can’t really describe that. It’s like if you’ve been doing something for half your life and your main influence and inspiration musically asked you to do a tour with them. It’s such an honour, I don’t want to say it was a once in a lifetime opportunity because I like to keep the future open.
Mike: Only people in bands can understand, or people who really love music. It’s like you love music, everybody who is a superstar is a super fan of somebody else. When you get a chance to play with bands that influenced you in that way, it’s like being around an artist who’s affected your life, and that’s badass! Then when that artist goes away and you think they’re never going to exist again, and then that artist comes back and you might only get to see them for a short minute. The best thing about going to do that tour is that we knew we got to see every show. They killed it, they brought it and it was perfect! It’s kind of like a nice reward to get that gift. Being in a band is brutal sometimes, it’s nice to do something that’s meaningful that isn’t about the money. That was really worth it.
WTL!: You returned to work with producer Brian McLennan for this album, who produced your debut album. Why did you return to Brian?
Mike: We did two records with Devin Townsend, and it was to the point that Devin has a sound and it was creeping into the style of the band too. It wasn’t in a bad way, it’s more like we have a new guitar player what do we do? We could either go work with Devin and do “Deliver Us” part 3 and just go for that, or we could try and continuously shake it up and do something different. We wanted to keep it local because we had gone to Sweden and to Vancouver and all these places that were super expensive. This was our last record on Victory so we had to think somewhere that was a little bit more like home. I’ve worked a lot at Brian’s studio and I’ve been friends with him for a really long time so it is a comfortable place to record an album. He is very competent; he records huge records and sick records (Converge, From Autumn to Ashes). It just felt like the right decision. We had to find somebody different but we couldn’t afford the uber producers, and we really weren’t looking for that. We were looking for somebody who would help us make a sick Darkest Hour record that people would like who like the band. Brain defiantly knew what people like about Darkest Hour, and it was the same vision we had.
John: We wanted to kind of redefine our sound too.
Mike: You can’t keep doing the same thing. Devin (Townsend) is sick, what do you want me to say? The Swedes were sick, we learned from them, we learned from Devin. Recording and doing bands is all about changing and learning from every time you do it. Once you’ve met with all these grand wizards and they’ve passed you their deep dark secrets out of their crystal balls they say “carry on my son to someone new.”
WTL!: Where did you come up with the title The Eternal Return?
John: I was reading about it, and this is a theory about how the world keeps repeating itself over and over again. The whole kind of theme of the record to me was that I was thinking about our whole experience as a band from the beginning to where we are at right now, about how we kind of got stuck in this cycle with our label that we were on for a while. We signed when we were kids. It just felt like we were doing the same thing over and over again with them. That theme carried over throughout the record in between every song. It wasn’t a huge theme of the record, more like a subtle theme. It finds its way in and out of every song. But of course every song is about something completely different.
Mike: I think that the cool thing with the way that John writes lyrics is that I can relate to them through that. But other people can relate to them through other things. It’s not a record that’s all about how being in a band sucks or something like that, but I think even music and art now the way everything has changed since metal and punk got homogenized by the internet. Everything is totally different now. I think that it’s like now that bands go on tour and they don’t even sell CDs. We sell t-shirts because nobody even gives a shit. They all download the CD and then soon people are going to have enough black t-shirts! (Laughs) We’re going to have to start selling video games now! (Laughs) Now the only thing they want to do is play along with their guitar. It’s just really weird because the thing that really has value is the tunes. Everything has really changed when you’re in it and live it every day like we do and tour all the time. We’re in this band all the time, so you can’t help but reflect on a new record.
WTL!: How did you come to use Sons of Nero for the album art?
John: They were recommended to us by our manager.
Mike: They are part of the whole Ferret, Channel Zero scene. We knew that they could handle putting a pdf together of some words. They did a good job and we’re stoked!
How do you feel about your albums appearance on the Billboard top 200 (they hit 104 with the latest, and their last 3 albums have charted)
Mike: I wanted it to be inside 100, and I don’t give a fuck! (Laughs) When we were recording the record our manager came in and was like “hey there isn’t a song like ‘Demon(s).”, and we were like that’s fine, we want to make this record. We want to make this statement. It doesn’t call for that type of song. It was a brutal record. We’re not saying we’ve changed our mind and that we’ll never do that again. This record didn’t call for that. We knew that we were taking steps to make a brutal, thrash, melodic death metal record that maybe only a couple people would get, because, only a couple of people only really get it and everybody else is a bunch of fucking idiots. Whether or not it landed on Billboard didn’t matter because the only thing that mattered is that people that really got the music got it. It was just a nice cool thing that happened that enough people got it at the same time that we could get in there and be put alongside artists who people think have value that suck. It would’ve been nice to be higher up but fuck ‘em! (Laughs) We may not be higher up in number but we’re way fucking better!
WTL!: Do you write songs with the live aspect in mind?
Mike: Yeah sometimes. We’ll be like “Dude that’ll suck live! It’s too long!” I think everyone does that. Usually things that work really well live work really well on the song.
WTL!: How would you say your sound has evolved, since you’ve got quite a few albums out now?
Mike: I think it’s more grown up. It feels like it’s gone through all these mangled corridors of us saying “who wants to do this?” Or “hey lets do this!” I think it’ll always be kind of like that but I think this is more of an intellectual version.
John: We went through a super melody zone which we will still definitely always have as part of our sound.
Mike: Which we’ll try, or experiment, or reserve the right to use.
John: I don’t care if we mix that up. We try to change it up a little bit but this captures an earlier sound of ours, a more pissed off sound.
Mike: You can’t explain, you just know when you go stand in the room, you’ll just play it and say “that’s the next song that is it!”
WTL!: What brought about the departure of Kris Norris from the band?
Mike: Let’s just put it this way – the thing that needed to happen for the band to continue and for Kris to have a better life was for us to split. We’re happy, we’ve seen Kris on this tour and he is doing great. He’s playing with God Forbid and he’s doing his guitar lesions. He has his thing going on and he’s cool. We’re very happy to be out here doing our thing. There’s not really a story that everybody wants to get of folding chairs through windows or something. It’s just like dude now Lonestar is in the band, and he’s sick. Watching Lonestar is sick! Just watch him! He’ll come out with a beard and be like “fuck yeah!”
WTL!: How did you come across Lonestar to replace Kris?
John: He was our tech for our tour last summer. He was kind of like a last second tech too. We had this guy hired and he flaked out, and Tito our tour manager called us and said “what about that dude Mike from At All Cost?” because he used to be in this band called At All Cost who toured with us a couple years ago. So we thought sure, that guy’s cool he’s got a beard! (Laughs) So he came out and was a tech for us, and we hit it off. Then we overhead him and he was kind of like a secret shredder, and we didn’t know he could do that. We’d hear him in the trailer fucking around, and when it all went down with Kris he was there. We knew he could play some of the songs. He’d sound checked for us when Kris couldn’t make it. We had him fill in, and it just made sense.
Mike: We could have gone on the internet and been like “Yo! Guitar shred-a-thon at every guitar centre!” Or paid Joe Satriani to be on the record, but Lonestar is badass and he fit in. This band isn’t about guitar solos, it’s about just some tunes, and he’s exactly what we were looking for.
John: When we stared writing it made sense too.
WTL!: What qualities has Lonestar brought to the band?
Mike: He’s a fresh look. He has a different look at the band. There’s a different perspective that we don’t have. He hasn’t been doing this as long as we have, and it’s nice because a band is like a little bubble that we all live in. We start to feed off of each other, and when you break the bubble, he brings in a different perspective to everything. From the way he plays the guitar, to the way he sees the tour. He’salso a little kid. He plays video games all day! He’s awesome! He gets in trouble! It’s like how we were 8 years ago before we grew up!
WTL!: What kind of trouble does he get into?
Mike: We’ll save that stuff for off the record! (Laughs)
John: He threw a bag of shit at a cop! (Laughs) He didn’t really intentionally do it, he had to take a shit on the bus. We were stuck in traffic so he had to shit in a bag and he didn’t know what to do with it. Somebody told him to throw it out the window, so he opened the door and threw it out of the bus. It goes right in front of these two motorcycle cops. We were driving down the highway and they stopped us. Asked us “what was that?” I don’t know what he was thinking he said “I had to shit in a bag and I threw it and I don’t know! I’m sorry!”
Mike: They thought it was trash, when they found out it was shit they were mad. (laughs)
WTL!: How do you feel about the connection to metalcore? Statements have evolved into “Darkest Hour is metalcore, but they’re good”, to people arguing whether your metalcore or not.
John: It’s weird because we were what everybody considers to be metalcore, and they consider us to be part of the beginning of it. Then all these bands came out and became metalcore, but I don’t think we went in that direction. When people say that we’re a metalcore band I’m used to it. I don’t give a shit. It’s kind of different now, because when we were kids metalcore was Converge, and Unbroken and Integrity and Earth Crisis. When we started out we were like that, we were like this band Damnation AD who was like a Metallica influenced hardcore band, like a Neurosis like Metallica influenced hardcore band. They were one of the reasons why we started Darkest Hour. Now it’s changed into this thing where there’s a shit load of metalcore bands that just have this Swedish riff and then, this melodic singing part, and then a breakdown. All of a sudden there is this whole genre and we got stuck with the tag, and it’s fucking bullshit.
Mike: We’re from the beginning if it’s metalcore that’s defined by a combination of metal and hardcore, and by hardcore music being defined as actual hardcore music, and metal music being defined as actual metal. The earlier stuff probably is that. “Mark of the Judas” probably is that. I think that’s why a lot of people actually like our first record because it probably is the truest metalcore album. Just because we tour a certain way, or just because we’re accessible to fans ,we get lumped in with a genre that we don’t actually fit in with musically. But whatever see you at the show, we’ll play to metalcore fans, or metal fans, or ska fans, or Anti-Flag fans…
John: It kind of makes sense because that’s where we started our band, through playing with more hardcore bands. I got into metal after I was into punk and hardcore. My favourite bands were Propogandi, Avail and Born Against. Punk bands. Then I got into metal bands later. I could see how people could think that, because we played with punk bands in the beginning.
Mike: I think it’s just so you can have your music marketed to you. I think people who listen to music can tell the difference.
John: Melodic/thrash/death metal is just too long.
Mike: Or what we’ve been described as being people who study metal. Whatever it takes man just listen to it, you can call it whatever you want. If you’re pissed off and full of rage just check this shit out!
WTL!: I’ve heard some stories behind the song “Oklahoma“. Exactly what happened there?
John: We got pulled over on tour right after we crossed over from Arkansas into Oklahoma. The cops were waiting behind the Oklahoma sign. They pulled up and there were two of them, looking inside the van, then they came up and said “we pulled you over because of this broken windshield and we see this open case of beer. You are not allowed to bring liquor over state lines”, “Dukes of Hazard” like, because I guess you can only buy this weak beer in stores in Oklahoma. So they said, “everybody out. That gives us probable cause, search the vehicle.” Everybody gets out and next thing you know they told us to get down on the ground. Everybody is face down getting handcuffed. They found in my bag in this jar that didn’t have anything in it, but it at one point had weed in it. It just had residue maybe some crystal like things in it. He saw that and told us since it was in the van he can charge everybody with personal possession. They took us to jail, so we sat in jail, no judge or anything.
Mike: As soon as they found out I had the bands money it all changed apparently. They agreed to let us buy our way out of jail, which we did once we went to the cops house where the van was impounded. We paid them a little more money there.
John: At the “impound lot”.
Mike: It was a mess but the end of the story is that we got the show that night!
WTL!: How do you feel about our current economic situation?
John: Totally fucked!
Mike: It was a legacy that was passed down to us from 8 years of George Bush. I don’t know if the Democratic Party in America or President Obama can really bring about any kind of change because I’m a person who doesn’t really believe either side. And I don’t think they can really change an economy that’s controlled by global factors. At least I can say with President Obama “I can agree with that! Wow!” He does say things that I say “oh no!” to. It’s not with George Bush who’d say things and I’d want to kill myself pretty much every time. So it seems like a step in the right direction. But what can I say this is brutal! We tour all the time and people buy less merch, less people come to shows, and people are out of jobs. It’s hard everywhere. I think the real thing is when people start realizing these arbitrary borders that we’ve made up really don’t matter anymore. The world is global, and the only lines are between rich and poor, not between the American and Canadian border which somebody made up. In reality it doesn’t exist, the only thing that does exist is the economic barriers that we’ve put up.
WTL!: How did you (to Mike) get the nickname “shitarm” Schleibaum?
Mike: I guess Paul calls me that every once in awhile because there’s this guy who has a tattoo on his neck and gets called “shitneck” !(Laughs) Paul is crazy so you never know!
WTL!: Is Ryan’s (Parrish, drummer) new hat as good as the old one? Has he ever been pictured without his hat?
Mike: I wish he’d give the hat up! I think it’s weird to wear the same pairs of clothes all the time, let alone the same hat.
John: Especially a winter toque!
Mike: We will be on the beach in July, it’s 102 degrees out, and it’s fucking weird! He’s his own beast. Ryan’s going to do whatever he wants to do, and you can’t fuck with him. You’ve got to love him because he has the hat on.
WTL!: What’s like being on tour with Suffocation?
Mike: They were great! We’ve toured with so many metal bands that fucking suck as people and as bands. These guys were the opposite of all those things. They’re an old band, and it was an inspiration.
John: They’re just dudes who are obviously aren’t going to be famous. They’re only out touring and playing music because they love it. Terrance (Hobbs, guitar) would say “I can do this shit forever man! You know hanging out, playing music, smoking weed!” They Made us feel like chumps for every time we go “God damn, we’ve been doing this for 10 fucking years!”
Mike: Also Ryan our drummer, he loves Suffocation. When he was little he moshed at a Suffocation show and got on stage. He gets all nostalgic about it. He was stoked, it wasn’t like his At The Gates but it was pretty close. He loves that band.
WTL!: There have been stories of bands resorting to eating peanut butter and beef jerky for dinner on tour. Have food choices ever become slim for you on tour?
Mike: Yeah, Ryan used to go into Taco Bell. We’d roll up he’d go in there and tell them that we’re missing two burritos, then they’d give him the burritos, then he’d go across the street to the McDonalds and tell them they messed up the order and he’d get an order of fries! (Laughs) Ryan can get a whole meal for free! He can get into a movie theatre with no problems! (Laughs) This man can work his shit. He’s a legend! Food choices have been a problem but dudes are crafty!
WTL!: Who would you tour with if you had no rules?
John: We would have to do another At The Gates tour.
Mike: Are you kidding? You’ve done that once! Have a little respect! You mean going back in time? Jimi Hendrix! There are so many options! Nirvana!
John: We could do some big ones, like Led Zepplin.
Mike: You have to go with the big ones AC/DC in their early years. Megadeth during the “Rust in Peace” era, and they’d only play a half set because they’re going to split it with Metallica who’s only going to play the riffs from Kill ‘Em All and Master of Puppets!
John: I don’t know who we’re going to have open.
Mike: It’s your call you can pick the opener.
John: Beneath the Massacre, because they’re our buddies.
WTL!: Who would you like to tour with that is both feasible, but not obvious?
Mike: In Flames! We’ve never toured with them. I love In Flames. What’s the problem. Darkest Hour and In Flames makes sense! Iron Maiden as well.
WTL!: Where in the world would you like to tour?
Mike: Asia. And an outpost in Antarctica, but I wouldn’t want to do that for free.
John: Africa!
Mike: Oh yeah, Africa.
John: The middle east.
Mike: Syria! Somewhere fucked up. Somewhere that we’d have to get flown into. Maybe Iraq, but not necessarily for the troops, maybe just for some folks on a street corner. Everybody could come down and party at that thing, and it’d be rowdy as fuck! China! We have to break these borders, and I think once we break them down we can solve a lot of these cultural differences. We’ve been a lot of places – it’s pretty cool!
WTL!: Have you ever lied about your band name and what it means?
Mike: Dying Fetus does that. They’ll usually say they’re Kataklysm. They don’t want to go through that shit! They just want to smoke some weed and eat some patties! (laughs)
John: We did tell people one time that our tour bus was the crew for Nickleback, and it was just to impress some chicks. Darkest Hour doesn’t sound as cool as Nickeleback’s crew.
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